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Damjan
stripovi.com suradnik
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Italy
1458 Posts
Member since 12/02/2004 |
Posted - 13/12/2004 : 23:36:51
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Dakle, u kontekstu novih Bookglobe-ovih Lucky Luke albuma... Kod nas su se (pre)dugo preštampavale stare epizode Morrisa & Goscinnyija, pa bi se možda moglo posvetiti koju rijec novim autorima serijala.
Što se tice scenarija, meni osobno najbolji dojam ostavio je Nordmann, prica mu je tecna i spontana, a humor nekako prirodniji nego kod Gerre i De Groota... Što je cudno, jer mi se De Groot poprilicno svidio kao autor Leonarda. No, sva trojica debelo zaostaju za Goscinnyijem, barem za sada... A možda je razlog tome i cinjenica da se sam serijal istrošio nakon svih tih godina.
A po pitanju novog crtaca, Achdea, malo što se može reci - odabrao je crtati identicno kao Morris, a pitam se i je li uopce imao izbora.
Anyway, vaši dojmovi?
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Damjan
stripovi.com suradnik
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Italy
1458 Posts
Member since 12/02/2004 |
Posted - 14/12/2004 : 01:22:01
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Mda, zaboravio sam Yann-a, koji mi je najgori medu novima (vidim da je pisao i Marsupilamija), a "Most na Mississipiju" nisam citao, tako da o dvojcu Fauche/Leturgie ne mogu govoriti.
Btw, za one koji nisu u tijeku, momci o kojima se govori su, redom: Fauche/Leturgie, scenarij za Lucky Luke: "Most na Mississipiju" Yann, scenarij za Lucky Luke: "Klondike" Nordmann, scenarij za Lucky Luke: "Prorok" De Groot, scenarij za Lucky Luke: "Slikar" Gerra, scenarij za Lucky Luke: "Lijepa Provincija" Achde, crtež za Lucky Luke: "Lijepa Provincija"
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Aco
stripovi.com suradnik
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Slovenia
6273 Posts
Member since 29/11/2001 |
Posted - 14/12/2004 : 11:28:26
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Dobar topic.Evo i mojih ocjena:
Fauche/Leturgie, scenarij za Lucky Luke: "Most na Mississipiju" Slabašno i nezanimljivo.Ništa posebno.I inace mi taj tandem ne leži.
Yann, scenarij za Lucky Luke: "Klondike" Kriminalno loše.Sa velikim naporom sam uspio procitati do kraja.
Nordmann, scenarij za Lucky Luke: "Prorok" Prosjecno.Zamjeram na prevelikom forsiranju Daltona dok se Talicni pojavljuje dosta rijetko.Ali u usporedbi sa novijim autorima i nije tako loš.
De Groot, scenarij za Lucky Luke: "Slikar" Ovo mi je dosad najbolja epizoda,dobro sam se nasmijao(pogotovo sa Indijanskim poglavicom koji pleše ples kiše) i sve pohvale De Grootu.
Gerra, scenarij za Lucky Luke: "Lijepa Provincija" Nisam uspio procitati do kraja pa ne mogu ništa reci.
Achde, crtež za Lucky Luke: "Lijepa Provincija" Vec sam to prije rekao i složio bih se sa Damjanom.Achde je odlucio kopirati Morrisa tako da je crtež odlican,naravno.Kad su pozadine i detalji u pitanju,meni je cak Achde bolji od Morrisovih radova u poslednjim epizodama njegovog opusa.Vjerojatno ce Ache u kasnijim epizodama ipak unijeti nešto svojeg u njih.
Bond.James Bond. |
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Damjan
stripovi.com suradnik
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Italy
1458 Posts
Member since 12/02/2004 |
Posted - 14/12/2004 : 14:03:26
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U stvari, i u staroj Jugi je objavljena jedna epizoda novih autora, "Nitroglicerin", i ta mi je bila sasvim ok kad sam bio klinac. Baš da provjerim tko je scenarist..... Hmmmm..... Crtao je definitivno Morris, a - evo ga - napisao je Van Banda. Nemam pojma kako bi mi danas legla ta epizoda, izgubio sam je negdje... |
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Prodigy
Senior Member
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Croatia
1801 Posts
Member since 01/12/2003 |
Posted - 14/12/2004 : 21:45:49
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Spomenuo bi "Most na Mississipiju",po meni- jako dobar!!!
Hi, i am an Albanian virus but becouse of poor technology in my country i am not able to do anything vith your computer. Please be so kind to delite one of your files and than forvard me to other users. Thanks! |
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VALTER
Advanced Member
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Croatia
6414 Posts
Member since 21/07/2002 |
Posted - 18/12/2004 : 00:56:03
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"Proroka" nisam procitao, ali pretpostavljam da je na razini "Mosta na Mississipiju", "Klondikea", "Slikara" i "Lijepe provincije", sto ce reci - lose do prosjecno. Nema tu kvalitetnog humora, previse infantilno u odnosu na Goscinnya.
I da, smucilo mi se dok sam citao "Lijepu provinciju" - frankofoni Kanadjani u Quebecu i tamosnji Indijanci govore kajkavskim narjecjem. Nije ovo dijalektalna knjizevnost vec prijevod jednog stranog stripa - a ako se htjela napraviti distinkcija izmedju jezika kojim govori Lucky i onog kojim se sluze Qebecani moglo se to izvesti na manje iritantan nacin.
Novi crtac Achde je odlicno odradio svoj posao, stvarno je tesko primjetiti razliku u odnosu na Morrisa, a tako i treba biti kada se radi o stripu koji je toliko stilski prepoznatljiv kao sto je Talicni. Nakon vise od pedeset godina ruzno bi bilo mijenjati bilo sto.
Mada, kao sto rece Damjan, serijal se istrosio, i pitanje je ima li se tu jos nesto reci. Nikad vise nece biti duhovite epizode kao sto je "Sudija Roj Bin" i nezaboravne scene poput one kad Bean u nedostatku zatvorskih prostorija veze Talicnog lancem za drvo; lancem za isto drvo privezan je i Beanov medvjed koj pocinje naganjati Talicnog, dok Bean skuplja oklade... A ako nema takvog humora, casno bi bilo da se serijal prekine - jasno da je to nemoguce dok god postoji mogucnost zarade. I ja cu kupovati nove epizode kao kolekcionar, ali sumnjam da cu ih citati. |
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Damjan
stripovi.com suradnik
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Italy
1458 Posts
Member since 12/02/2004 |
Posted - 18/12/2004 : 01:55:01
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Mislim da je glavni problem bio u Morrisovoj zabludi. Naime, suprotno cestom mišljenu, Luckyija nisu stvorili Morris i Goscinny, nego Morris sam. Goscinny se pridružio serijalu tek kasnije, a kada je umro, pretpostavljam da se Morris sjetio onih starih dana dok je Luckyija radio sam. Tada je, vjerojatno, pomislio da serijal može nastaviti bez Goscinnyija, kao što ga je radio i prije. No, scenarije je prepustio drugim autorima. To je, po mom mišljenju bila zabluda. Prije svega zbog toga što je Goscinny ostavio predubok trag i podigao cijelu stvar na jedan viši nivo, i nakon njega nije se moglo nastaviti s istom lakocom kao i prije nego što se pojavio. No, ako je vec morao nastaviti nakon Goscinnyijeve smrti, trebao je zadržati sve u svojim rukama (ono malo njegovih scenarija koje sam citao sasvim su ok). |
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VALTER
Advanced Member
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Croatia
6414 Posts
Member since 21/07/2002 |
Posted - 19/12/2004 : 21:25:03
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Povlacim svoju tvrdnju u vezi Nordmannovog "Proroka" - definitivno najduhovitiji (izuzmemo li, dakako, "Poseban tretman") Lucky kojeg je Bookglobe izdao. Premda, motiv fanatika-propovjednika mogao se i bolje iskoristiti u stvaranju humoristicne price. |
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VALTER
Advanced Member
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Croatia
6414 Posts
Member since 21/07/2002 |
Posted - 11/07/2007 : 20:04:05
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UŽE OKO VRATA crtež Achde scenarij Achde & Gerra
Kaznionice su prenapucene, pa je robija od 387 godina preinacena u smrtnu kaznu koju braca Dalton mogu izbjeci samo ako se ožene, a oženit ce cetiri pripadnice plemena Ravnih glava, iz cega ce proizaci više nego solidna epizoda Talicnog. Humor na trenutke podsjeca na zlatni period ovog stripa. A i u Bookglobeu su, cini se, shvatili da vestern-parodija ne trpi kajkaviziranje, pa u ovom albumu prijevod i prilagodbu potpisuju Željko Tešovic i Edvin Salihovic. |
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The Hammer of Hell
Average Member
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Croatia
945 Posts
Member since 10/12/2006 |
Posted - 11/07/2007 : 20:34:24
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quote: Originally posted by VALTER
UŽE OKO VRATA crtež Achde scenarij Achde & Gerra
Kaznionice su prenapucene, pa je robija od 387 godina preinacena u smrtnu kaznu koju braca Dalton mogu izbjeci samo ako se ožene, a oženit ce cetiri pripadnice plemena Ravnih glava, iz cega ce proizaci više nego solidna epizoda Talicnog. Humor na trenutke podsjeca na zlatni period ovog stripa. A i u Bookglobeu su, cini se, shvatili da vestern-parodija ne trpi kajkaviziranje, pa u ovom albumu prijevod i prilagodbu potpisuju Željko Tešovic i Edvin Salihovic.
Nažalost, epizoda je katastrofa. Ponadao sam se nakon vrlo solidne "Lijepe provincije" da nova ekipa može izbaciti još koju dobru epizodu, ali poslije ove, sumnjam. Goscinny je i dalje bog.
A kajkavski u "Lijepoj provinciji" je bio izvanredno pogoden, to je najzad bio jedan duhoviti domaci prijevod nakon stoljeca suše. "Prekleti..." i brat od kobile Provincije po imenu Kanton:):):)
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kico
Advanced Member
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Croatia
11381 Posts
Member since 22/12/2004 |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 10:21:03
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Da,Goscinny je i dalje Bog! Al ekipa se trudi....i to se vidi. Humor je bitan za Talicnoga i ova nova epizoda je prepuna humora. Najvažnije je da Talicni jaše i dalje.... |
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mifugo
Senior Member
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1007 Posts
Member since 28/05/2005 |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 10:56:59
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quote:
I da, smucilo mi se dok sam citao "Lijepu provinciju" - frankofoni Kanadjani u Quebecu i tamosnji Indijanci govore kajkavskim narjecjem. Nije ovo dijalektalna knjizevnost vec prijevod jednog stranog stripa - a ako se htjela napraviti distinkcija izmedju jezika kojim govori Lucky i onog kojim se sluze Qebecani moglo se to izvesti na manje iritantan nacin.
tako je i bavarski njemacki prevoden u karlu mayu...  |
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darth-vader
Advanced Member
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Croatia
4834 Posts
Member since 05/10/2002 |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 13:54:26
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U zadnjih nekoliko epizoda Morris mi je bio totalno iritantan, jednostavno se izgubio ( godine su ipak tu ). Crtež mu je bio ispodprosjecan, i da je to bio netko drugi a ne Morris, napali bi ga svim sredstvima. Pozadina nigdje, kompozicija nikakva, samo likovi... kao Pratt u Mu...samo što je Pratt tamo ipak bolji Achde mi je genijalan. Unio je potrebnu svježinu u žanr i podignuo crtež na novu razinu. Ove dvije njegove epizode što sam ih citao su mi vizualno prekrasne, a i scenaristicki su mi skroz ok Morris s pocetka mi je super ( ipak sam na njega naviknuo ), ali s kraja...jad i bijeda
if you only knew the power of the dark side |
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delboj
stripovi.com suradnik
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Bosnia and Herzegovina
17211 Posts
Member since 01/03/2004 |
Posted - 25/07/2007 : 18:19:17
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quote: Originally posted by VALTER
UŽE OKO VRATA crtež Achde scenarij Achde & Gerra
Kaznionice su prenapucene, pa je robija od 387 godina preinacena u smrtnu kaznu koju braca Dalton mogu izbjeci samo ako se ožene, a oženit ce cetiri pripadnice plemena Ravnih glava, iz cega ce proizaci više nego solidna epizoda Talicnog. Humor na trenutke podsjeca na zlatni period ovog stripa. A i u Bookglobeu su, cini se, shvatili da vestern-parodija ne trpi kajkaviziranje, pa u ovom albumu prijevod i prilagodbu potpisuju Željko Tešovic i Edvin Salihovic.
Crtež je odlican, a sama epizoda je solidna. Ipak, predaleko je to od nivoa starih epizoda. |
Edited by - delboj on 25/07/2007 18:20:01 |
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