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senokute
Senior Member
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Germany
1367 Posts
Member since 08/01/2011 |
Posted - 13/06/2014 : 21:24:48
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quote: Originally posted by Beva
quote: Originally posted by DODSFERD
Iz svega ovdje postavljenog je vidljivo da su u pitanju 3 Vernijeve epizode; ''Povratak Mortimera'', ''Zagor protiv Mortimera'' i ''Povratak mutanta'' i ne vidim razlog da se Verni toliko razapinje zbog nečega što je radio na početku svoje karijere na Zagoru gdje postoji i mogućnost da je dobio takve smjernice da što više iskopira Ferrija.
Odgovorno tvrdim da Verni prekopira preko 90 % likova u svojim stripovima, ako ne i sve. Pa čovjek čak kopira i Ferrijeve okoliše, što dalje pričati?
Nekad je to radio i Bignotti, ali on je s vremenom prestao.
I kažem da to što radi Verni može raditi i bilo koji imalo iskusniji amaterski crtač. Evo čak bih i ja to mogao, samo što bi me bilo stid. Ništa lakše od precrtavanja.
pa eto hajde,,,probaj nacrtati nesto od ferrija, i baci malo tinte na to,pa da pogledamo,, isto vazi i za Brdara i ostale koji tvrde da se to moze lahko precrtati,,volio bih vidjeti rezultat |
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PijaniPatak
stripovi.com suradnik
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Germany
10035 Posts
Member since 20/02/2010 |
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Beva
Advanced Member
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Bosnia and Herzegovina
6218 Posts
Member since 04/06/2007 |
Posted - 13/06/2014 : 21:48:16
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quote: Originally posted by senokute
pa eto hajde,,,probaj nacrtati nesto od ferrija, i baci malo tinte na to,pa da pogledamo,, isto vazi i za Brdara i ostale koji tvrde da se to moze lahko precrtati,,volio bih vidjeti rezultat
Nažalost, nemam nijedan Zagorov strip, sve sam ih poklonio mlađim rođacima, a teško mi precrtavati s ekrana :)
Evo Wolland je puno kvalitetniji, a čak ni ne precrtava, samo oponaša Ferrija. |
Jubilarni Polo 10!http://forum.stripovi.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=51213 |
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velka031
Advanced Member
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Croatia
17049 Posts
Member since 18/03/2010 |
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PijaniPatak
stripovi.com suradnik
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Germany
10035 Posts
Member since 20/02/2010 |
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Brdar
Senior Member
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Bosnia and Herzegovina
2770 Posts
Member since 22/10/2003 |
Posted - 13/06/2014 : 21:58:08
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quote: Originally posted by senokute
quote: Originally posted by Beva
quote: Originally posted by DODSFERD
Iz svega ovdje postavljenog je vidljivo da su u pitanju 3 Vernijeve epizode; ''Povratak Mortimera'', ''Zagor protiv Mortimera'' i ''Povratak mutanta'' i ne vidim razlog da se Verni toliko razapinje zbog nečega što je radio na početku svoje karijere na Zagoru gdje postoji i mogućnost da je dobio takve smjernice da što više iskopira Ferrija.
Odgovorno tvrdim da Verni prekopira preko 90 % likova u svojim stripovima, ako ne i sve. Pa čovjek čak kopira i Ferrijeve okoliše, što dalje pričati?
Nekad je to radio i Bignotti, ali on je s vremenom prestao.
I kažem da to što radi Verni može raditi i bilo koji imalo iskusniji amaterski crtač. Evo čak bih i ja to mogao, samo što bi me bilo stid. Ništa lakše od precrtavanja.
pa eto hajde,,,probaj nacrtati nesto od ferrija, i baci malo tinte na to,pa da pogledamo,, isto vazi i za Brdara i ostale koji tvrde da se to moze lahko precrtati,,volio bih vidjeti rezultat
Evo, senokute. To sto nisam precrtao svaku liniju je zato sto je strip parodija, pa kad je kadar precrtavan, smatrap sam da je dovoljno i ovoliko.  
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Space Marine
Senior Member
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Croatia
1308 Posts
Member since 08/09/2013 |
Posted - 13/06/2014 : 22:54:07
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quote: Originally posted by Zagor i Ogi
quote: Originally posted by sergej773
Chiarolla – 7/10
Chiarolla 1/10
Meni je on sasvim ok crtač, samo što mislim da bi mu bolje pasala horror tematika. Volio bih ga vidjeti na Dylanu Dogu, a na pamet mi pada neko bolesno reizdanje Walking Deada iz njegovoga pera. |
Sometimes good guys gotta do bad things to make the bad guys pay. |
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Zagor i Ogi
Average Member
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Serbia
851 Posts
Member since 16/09/2013 |
Posted - 13/06/2014 : 23:12:14
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quote: Originally posted by senokute
quote: Originally posted by Zagor i Ogi
quote: Originally posted by sergej773
Chiarolla – 7/10
Chiarolla 1/10
momak, ti si nekom mazno avatar
Sta cu kad je lep
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The only good thing in life isZAGOR |
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Zagor i Ogi
Average Member
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Serbia
851 Posts
Member since 16/09/2013 |
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DODSFERD
Advanced Member
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Pitcairn Island
29953 Posts
Member since 14/03/2014 |
Posted - 13/06/2014 : 23:49:35
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quote: Originally posted by Beva Odgovorno tvrdim da Verni prekopira preko 90 % likova u svojim stripovima, ako ne i sve. Pa čovjek čak kopira i Ferrijeve okoliše, što dalje pričati?
A ti si mu držao svijeću dok je precrtavao pa znaš točno o kojem se postotku radi  Kada su velikani EsseGesse prestali s radom na Bleku neki crtači koji su došli nakon njih su kopirali identična lica i kretnje glavna 3 lika, sporedne likove, okoliš, šumu, traperske kolibe, utvrde, zgrade i još mnoštvo drugih sitnica i nikada to za čitatelje nije predstavljalo problem niti je svijet zbog toga stao. Zagor jest kvalitetniji i ozbiljniji strip ali u nekim svjetskim okvirima ima isti značaj kao i Blek.
quote: I kažem da to što radi Verni može raditi i bilo koji imalo iskusniji amaterski crtač. Evo čak bih i ja to mogao, samo što bi me bilo stid. Ništa lakše od precrtavanja.
Čak bih i ja da se malo potrudim mogao odglumiti revolveraša iz ''Dobar, loš, zao'' identično kao Clint Eastwood samo što bi me bilo stid. Ništa lakše nego odglumiti takvu ulogu.  |
Sinaitakala Tu'imatamoana 'i Fanakavakilangi Fakafanua |
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Brdar
Senior Member
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Bosnia and Herzegovina
2770 Posts
Member since 22/10/2003 |
Posted - 14/06/2014 : 01:55:37
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I evo maksuz za kolegu senokutea (a i za ostale koji prate ovaj topic, naravno), odradio sam precrtavanje jos dva kadra, jedan plan i jedna poza sa određenim izmjenama/doradama, kako to cesto radi Verni. Donji kadar je nesto losiji jer uslijedio blagi pad koncentracije.  
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Edited by - Brdar on 14/06/2014 02:26:28 |
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nagor
Advanced Member
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Croatia
12553 Posts
Member since 21/02/2012 |
Posted - 14/06/2014 : 02:58:06
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Brdare, ako ovako nastaviš još ćeš i dobiti posao umjesto Ferrija.  Uglavnom, efektno si dokazao to što govoriš. 
Bravo i za Solara i Patka za ovaj topic. Jedan od boljih ove godine.
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sergej773
Senior Member
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Cuba
1922 Posts
Member since 03/06/2012 |
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PijaniPatak
stripovi.com suradnik
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Germany
10035 Posts
Member since 20/02/2010 |
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Zagor i Ogi
Average Member
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Serbia
851 Posts
Member since 16/09/2013 |
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DODSFERD
Advanced Member
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Pitcairn Island
29953 Posts
Member since 14/03/2014 |
Posted - 14/06/2014 : 11:13:55
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Vrlo dobro je ispalo iako je na drugom crtežu Zagor nešto mršaviji.  Zanima me koliko je vremena potrebno za ovakvo nešto i da li je brže raditi na osnovi drugog crteža ili onako iz glave? |
Sinaitakala Tu'imatamoana 'i Fanakavakilangi Fakafanua |
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King Warrior
stripovi.com suradnik
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22339 Posts
Member since 10/11/2007 |
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Gru
Average Member
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833 Posts
Member since 07/01/2014 |
Posted - 14/06/2014 : 12:32:26
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quote: Originally posted by DODSFERD
Vrlo dobro je ispalo iako je na drugom crtežu Zagor nešto mršaviji.  Zanima me koliko je vremena potrebno za ovakvo nešto i da li je brže raditi na osnovi drugog crteža ili onako iz glave?
Pa uvijek je brže raditi kad nešto precrtavaš. Sve linije i odnosi među linijama su već tu, definirani, na tebi je samo da te linije usporedo popratiš i paff, na taj način svatko može biti Ferri, Villa, John Buscema, Stan Lee... |
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Archy
stripovi.com suradnik
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Croatia
1448 Posts
Member since 27/11/2008 |
Posted - 14/06/2014 : 13:20:38
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Ono što se meni čini, je da kad govorimo o precrtavanju, ljudi neke stvari brkaju. Npr, nije isto ako crtač koristi iste detalje u svome crtežu kao i neki drugi crtač, ako radi na istom liku. Međutim, precrtavanje je ako crtač koristi identične kadrove.
Crtanje je vještina, a kadriranje je ipak jedna stepenica više. Ako scenarist napiše šturi scenarij, onda crtač mora popuniti rupe. Što bolje popunjava te rupe, to je je crtež življi, tijek radnje je zanimljiviji i slično.
Verni zaista ima sličan stil kao i Ferri. Međutim, kao što je Brdar vrlo uspješno pokazao, nije najveći problem uhvatiti nečiji stil. Veći je problem u organizaciji kadrova i tijeku priče. Možda je jedan od razloga što Verni nije profi crtač, nego se uključio u taj posao dosta kasno i dosta slučajno. Možda čovjek nije kreativan, pa u nedostatku inspiracije traži već gotova rješenja.
Ipak, očito je da se Burratini i Verni slažu. Bure sada već veliki broj važnih priča prepušta upravo Verniju. Prema tome, mislim da su ovakve nekakve kritike dobrodošle, jer će čovjek valjda vidjeti da ne može na taj način raditi dovijeka. Mora se i Verni malo trgnuti i "osamostaliti". |
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Brdar
Senior Member
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Bosnia and Herzegovina
2770 Posts
Member since 22/10/2003 |
Posted - 14/06/2014 : 15:36:39
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Hvala svima za pohvale na racun mog precrtavanja, a posebno me je nasmijao Kingov komentar o usvajanju.  
@ DODSFERD - sto se tice vremena, za ovaj proces precrtavanja trebalo mi je nekih sat i po do dva (poceo nekih pet minuta prije pocetka, a zavrsio nekih 10-ak minuta prije kraja utakmice CILE - AUSTRALIJA 3:1). A sta je teze, precrtavati ili crtati iz svoje glave - Gru i Archy su u prethodnim postovima dali odlicno objasnjenje.  |
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senokute
Senior Member
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Germany
1367 Posts
Member since 08/01/2011 |
Posted - 14/06/2014 : 15:55:18
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quote: Originally posted by Brdar
I evo maksuz za kolegu senokutea (a i za ostale koji prate ovaj topic, naravno), odradio sam precrtavanje jos dva kadra, jedan plan i jedna poza sa određenim izmjenama/doradama, kako to cesto radi Verni. Donji kadar je nesto losiji jer uslijedio blagi pad koncentracije.  
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iako si ovo inkovo flomasterom stvarno dobro izgleda,,prilicno slicno originalu,(naprvoj slici je nos mogao biti malo kraci i usta malo manja i blize nosu,ali stvarno jedva vidljivo)uglavnom bravo za ovo,,nego nevezano za ovu temu kad vec cesto crtas a i ide ti od ruke, zasto konacno ne pocnes raditi sa valjanim alatom? |
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Brdar
Senior Member
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Bosnia and Herzegovina
2770 Posts
Member since 22/10/2003 |
Posted - 14/06/2014 : 18:35:40
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@ senokute - hvala puno, dobro oko imas, samo si pogrijesio sto se materijala tice - prvi kadar je urađen 2B olovkom, a u drugom sam koristio kemijsku olovku za tanke linije, a ostale deblje i tamnije nijanse sam uradio sa 2B olovkom. Skenirao sam kao GREYSCALE, a poslije u Photoshopu dodatno potamnio. 
A jedini razlog sto jos uvijek ne koristim valjani materijal (bilo da se radi o cetkicama/kistovima, tusu, papiru ili pak nekom od tableta) je taj sto su mi trenutno finansijski nedostupni jer sam nezaposlen.
Osim toga, jos sam i muzicar, pa za ono nesto sto sam ustedio moram kupiti novu gitaru (stara je skoro pa na izdisaju), a i tu imam problem, u Travniku i okolini nema radnje sa muzickom opremom koja mi odgovara (ima FIS Vitez, ali tu su gitare uglanom za amatere, a ja sam puno bolji gitarist nego crtac ), a nikako da nađem vremena da odvojim jedan dan da odem u Sarajevo ili Zenicu (nemam auto pa sam ovisan o bus -liniji, a to mrzim).  
Inace, kad smo kod nabavke materijala za crtanje u Travniku,samo da kazem da u travnickim knjizarama nema 2B olovaka , dalje necu ni da pricam.
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ike666
Average Member
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709 Posts
Member since 01/11/2012 |
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Bruce Springsteen
Advanced Member
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5546 Posts
Member since 28/10/2008 |
Posted - 14/06/2014 : 20:38:57
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Mangiantini - Osim pejzaža i pozadine, sve ostalo loše, Zagor katastrofa... jedan veliki minus 
Di Vittovi - Prosečno za Zagora, ali prihvatljivo
Torricelli - Menja stil, više mi se sviđa u gigantu, nego recimo u Princu vilenjaka, inače sve u svemu odličan
Prisco - Zagor mu je grublji od Ferrievog, što na neki način ne znači misus, drugačiji, ali sasvim dobar
Ferri – Maestro... i više od toga, nek crta dok može
Laurenti - Odličan crtač i umetnik, ali ne i za Zagora
Della Monica - Zagor mu je kao Ferriev, ali sasvim na njegov način, vrhunski
Bisi - Biću malo subjektivan, jer mi je prošle godine u Kragujevcu nacrtao Zagora fantastično, odličan, samo malo više emocija kao što reče King
Verni – Plagijator ili ne, meni najdraži posle Ferria
Sedioli - Ima potencijala, ali mislim da će teško napredovati na bolje, ovako loše
Gramaccioni – Nedopadljivo, loše za moj ukus
Cassarovi – Slično kao predhodni
Nuccio – Samo kad bi više crtao, fantasičan, najbolji
D’Arcangelo - Kad vidim Mangiantinia, čak mi je dobar
Barison - Nešto novo, sasvim drugačije, stravično i odlično
Pesce – Meni lično se ne sviđa, mada nije loše
Chiarolla – Zbog njega čovek može da prestane da čita Zagora 
Espositovci – Fantastični, toliko Ferrievski, a ipak imaju svoj pečat
Rubini – Slično kao i za Prisca, odličan
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Edited by - Bruce Springsteen on 14/06/2014 20:44:34 |
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senokute
Senior Member
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Germany
1367 Posts
Member since 08/01/2011 |
Posted - 14/06/2014 : 21:13:33
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quote: Originally posted by Brdar
@ senokute - hvala puno, dobro oko imas, samo si pogrijesio sto se materijala tice - prvi kadar je urađen 2B olovkom, a u drugom sam koristio kemijsku olovku za tanke linije, a ostale deblje i tamnije nijanse sam uradio sa 2B olovkom. Skenirao sam kao GREYSCALE, a poslije u Photoshopu dodatno potamnio. 
A jedini razlog sto jos uvijek ne koristim valjani materijal (bilo da se radi o cetkicama/kistovima, tusu, papiru ili pak nekom od tableta) je taj sto su mi trenutno finansijski nedostupni jer sam nezaposlen.
Osim toga, jos sam i muzicar, pa za ono nesto sto sam ustedio moram kupiti novu gitaru (stara je skoro pa na izdisaju), a i tu imam problem, u Travniku i okolini nema radnje sa muzickom opremom koja mi odgovara (ima FIS Vitez, ali tu su gitare uglanom za amatere, a ja sam puno bolji gitarist nego crtac ), a nikako da nađem vremena da odvojim jedan dan da odem u Sarajevo ili Zenicu (nemam auto pa sam ovisan o bus -liniji, a to mrzim).  
Inace, kad smo kod nabavke materijala za crtanje u Travniku,samo da kazem da u travnickim knjizarama nema 2B olovaka , dalje necu ni da pricam.
hmm,, malo sam nepromisljeno ovo napisao za pribor, da sam i ja dolje vjerovatno ne bih imao ni za olovku( inace sam rodom iz Kupresa) sad zivim u Bremen(svabija) ,,,,jedan drug mi radi u jednu dobru radnju za umjetnicki pribor (Gerstaecker) pa onda to sve dobijem dzabe ili vrlo jeftino. trenutno bih mogao opremiti Zagorov staf crtaca uglavnom sve imam, samo da je jos malo talenta kako stvari stoje ove godine necu za Bosnu ali ako hoces posalji mi adresu na PM da ti stogod posaljem,,napisi sta te interesuje,,koji papir, koja velicina cetki itd. |
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