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tinton
stripovi.com suradnik
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United Kingdom
19799 Posts
Member since 23/10/2011 |
Posted - 14/05/2014 : 23:50:05
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quote: Originally posted by PijaniPatak
Gomilu pitanja imam
Bure ni na jedno neće dati odgovor
Ako ga zapijes na crsu mozda I imas sanse. |
Dajte nam Banija Libre;može i mekokoricen (ali u boji obavezno)!
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DeeCay
stripovi.com suradnik
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Croatia
21661 Posts
Member since 24/09/2002 |
Posted - 15/05/2014 : 00:03:13
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quote: Originally posted by PijaniPatak
Gomilu pitanja imam Bure ni na jedno neće dati odgovor
Sigurno mu opsjedaš inbox i Zid na fejsu, mogu se kladiti! |
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies; the man who never reads lives only one." |
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PijaniPatak
stripovi.com suradnik
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Germany
10035 Posts
Member since 20/02/2010 |
Posted - 15/05/2014 : 00:06:35
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quote: Originally posted by DeeCay
quote: Originally posted by PijaniPatak
Gomilu pitanja imam Bure ni na jedno neće dati odgovor
Sigurno mu opsjedaš inbox i Zid na fejsu, mogu se kladiti!
Ma jok! Bio bi to uzaludan trud. Gomila ljudi mu šalje mailove, jadniče se redovno žali kako ih ne stigne sve pročitati
Ali da se nađem sa njim lice u lice, ja i radža bi imali šta da mu kažemo
BTW jedan savet: Burattini je tip čoveka kojeg moraš prvo dobrano nahvaliti da bi mu mogao postaviti kakvo škakljivo pitanje |
DNEVNIK CITANJA: Etika junaštva i deklišeizirani koreni u “Zagor prica...”
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Edited by - PijaniPatak on 15/05/2014 00:08:22 |
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DeeCay
stripovi.com suradnik
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Croatia
21661 Posts
Member since 24/09/2002 |
Posted - 16/05/2014 : 00:06:20
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quote: Originally posted by Deers Da li ovaj time-up sa Dragonerom znači da možemo uskoro očekivat i neke druge neobične projekte poput onog starog Andreuccijevog Zagora ili nešto deseto....
Stari Andreuccijev zagor? Malo detaljnije? |
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies; the man who never reads lives only one." |
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Deers
Advanced Member
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Croatia
9469 Posts
Member since 29/03/2004 |
Posted - 16/05/2014 : 07:40:24
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quote: Originally posted by DeeCay Stari Andreuccijev zagor? Malo detaljnije?
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LINK1 LINK2 LINK3
U kratkim crtama nekakva grafička novela sa starijim Zagorom za koju Andreucci ima ideju i koju bi volio raditi. |
"Trzaj mišica i nad prazninom sam." |
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DeeCay
stripovi.com suradnik
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Croatia
21661 Posts
Member since 24/09/2002 |
Posted - 16/05/2014 : 11:03:56
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haha, pa zar Andreucci pokušava napravi novi DKR, ili Watchmene, ili Kingdome come?
Nije teško pogoditi o čemu bi se radilo... Evo moje verzije. Nakon što mu je Hellingen ubio sve najmilije, spalio mu kolibu i ostavio ga u komi na 8 godina zagor se morao povuči u mirovinu. No nedavni događaji u Darkwoodu potaknu ga ponovno obuče staru majicu i vrati nepravdom razoreni darkwood. Prvi na listi za odsrjel su mu Hellingen i Mortimer, i Tkačev vanbračni sin Weaver Wood; a kao pomagače regrutira svoj starog frenda Tonku koji je izgubio jedno oko i ruku u zadnjem okršaju s Hellingenom, ostarjeli Supermike koji više i nije tako super, profesor Verybad i Barum Ikarovo pero koji pružaju logističku podršku; a sam Zagor trenira svom mladog pomoćnika, unuka zagorove nekadašnje ljubavi Fride Lang... |
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies; the man who never reads lives only one." |
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Zagor12
Advanced Member
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 - kopija.jpg)
Croatia
6763 Posts
Member since 23/08/2010 |
Posted - 16/05/2014 : 13:32:21
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quote: Originally posted by DeeCay
haha, pa zar Andreucci pokušava napravi novi DKR, ili Watchmene, ili Kingdome come?
Nije teško pogoditi o čemu bi se radilo... Evo moje verzije. Nakon što mu je Hellingen ubio sve najmilije, spalio mu kolibu i ostavio ga u komi na 8 godina zagor se morao povuči u mirovinu. No nedavni događaji u Darkwoodu potaknu ga ponovno obuče staru majicu i vrati nepravdom razoreni darkwood. Prvi na listi za odsrjel su mu Hellingen i Mortimer, i Tkačev vanbračni sin Weaver Wood; a kao pomagače regrutira svoj starog frenda Tonku koji je izgubio jedno oko i ruku u zadnjem okršaju s Hellingenom, ostarjeli Supermike koji više i nije tako super, profesor Verybad i Barum Ikarovo pero koji pružaju logističku podršku; a sam Zagor trenira svom mladog pomoćnika, unuka zagorove nekadašnje ljubavi Fride Lang...
Ovo zvuči kao miks između The Dark Knight Returns i Batman Beyond... |
Z12 je sada Golub, ali sajt je ostao isti: http://superheroji.com.hr/ - Najnovije iz svijeta superheroja
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DODSFERD
Advanced Member
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Pitcairn Island
29953 Posts
Member since 14/03/2014 |
Posted - 16/05/2014 : 13:37:25
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Pa koliko bi taj Zagor imao godina u ovome slučaju... nije valjda da bi čak i tada skakao po drveću i uzvikivao AHYAAAAAAAK.  |
Sinaitakala Tu'imatamoana 'i Fanakavakilangi Fakafanua |
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DeeCay
stripovi.com suradnik
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Croatia
21661 Posts
Member since 24/09/2002 |
Posted - 16/05/2014 : 14:22:49
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quote: Originally posted by DODSFERD
Pa koliko bi taj Zagor imao godina u ovome slučaju... nije valjda da bi čak i tada skakao po drveću i uzvikivao AHYAAAAAAAK. 
Pa više bi hodao i trčao nego skakao po lijanama; vidi se da je ostario, ali je figura i dalje impozantna - ali tu je barun Ikarovo pero da mu da zračnu podršku! ;) Verybad mu osigura dobre gadgete; a mali Lang (koji je btw. odrastao odrastao kod Sulivannovih cirkusanata gdje ga Frida sakrila od baruna rakosija, i tako stekao odlične akrobatske sposobnosti) poput svakog dobrog sidekicka odrađuje dobar dio Zagorovog posla. Hm, kako bi se mogao zvati mali Lang? Možda Patrick Z. Lang, po imenu stare ljubavi svoje bake Fride... |
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies; the man who never reads lives only one." |
Edited by - DeeCay on 16/05/2014 14:23:39 |
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Sneaksie Thiefsie
Advanced Member
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4689 Posts
Member since 22/04/2008 |
Posted - 16/05/2014 : 18:32:46
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quote: Originally posted by Deers
U kratkim crtama nekakva grafička novela sa starijim Zagorom za koju Andreucci ima ideju i koju bi volio raditi.
Kuso! a bas sam imao ideju da uradim jednu ako budem imao vremena... |
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solar
Moderator
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Croatia
21432 Posts
Member since 16/03/2004 |
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Poli
Advanced Member
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Slovenia
38181 Posts
Member since 26/10/2007 |
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markotamara
Senior Member
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Croatia
2783 Posts
Member since 26/05/2013 |
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DODSFERD
Advanced Member
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Pitcairn Island
29953 Posts
Member since 14/03/2014 |
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DeeCay
stripovi.com suradnik
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Croatia
21661 Posts
Member since 24/09/2002 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 11:07:23
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Mali izvještaj s Okruglog stola jučer na CRŠ-u...
Oko 7h započinje Okrugli stol: Ferrimenalno & Bonelli (štogod to točno značilo) – a sudjeluju: Roberto Diso, Marco Verni, Marcello Mangiantini, Moreno Burattini; uz svesrdnu podršku moderatora DeeCaya i prevoditeljice lijepog imena koje je dotičnome isparilo tijekom mnogih kasnije dešavanja i rješavanja tekućih problema. Ekipa je bila dobro raspoložena i puna dojmova i mišljenja; a moderator i publika izmjenjivali su se u pitanjima.
Burattini je priča o svojoj zaljubljenosti u Zagora, o novim stvarima koje nas očekuju nakon Južnoameričke odiseje (daleko ispred našeg Ludensa), ali Talijanima jako blizu, budući da se tako olako razbacuju spoilerima. Nakon dugog putovanja dakle, Zagor se vraća svome Darkwoodu i svojoj kućici u močvari Mo-Hi-La koja, na njihovo iznenađenje, biva razrušena; a krivac za to je ni manje ni više dijabolični Mortimer, genije zločina. Najavljuju čak i smrt dobrog Zagorovog prijatelja, pitam se kojeg. Dr. Metrevelića, Tonku ili pukovnika Perrija? Ili nekog četvrtog? Nitko dakle nije siguran! Nakon toga slijedi pustolovina u New Yorku, nakon mnogo godina, a događat će se u četvrti Little Italy, i lokacijama gdje se odigrao Scorseseov "Bande New Yorka". Ako se ne varam, to će raditi Mangiantini, a povratak Mortimera kao uvijek Verni. Burattini je također prenio pozdrave maestra Galliena Ferrija uz žaljenje što on osobno nije mogao doći. Razglabali smo zatim o mnogim važnim pitanjima koje muče zagorovce, a to je fizika čuvene Zagorove sjekire; na što je Burattini iznio moguće solucije.
Također smo saznali da je publika u Italiji još tradicionalnija od Ex-YU, (Verni ih je nazvao zagorovskim talibanima, a Burattini usporedio Vernija s klasičnim predstavnikom zagorovaca – nenaviknutim na promjene). Isto tako žene nisu i dalje dio sastav politike pisanje Zagorovih priča, opet zbog tradicionalnih postavki svijeta i vremena kad je Zagor nastao šezdesetih godina. Verniju je jako bilo smiješno kakav bi to bio junak koji bi kraj svojih pustolovina usput njihao malo dijete unutar svoje mlade obitelji ili se ljubio sa ženama. A i kad bi junak imao obitelj, neprijatelji bi uvijek krenuli prvo na njegov obitelj, a to ne bi baš bilo zgodno. Burattini to objašnjava Nolittinim riječima, da kad je gledao westerne i vidio Johna Waynea u akcijskoj sceni, to mu je kao djetetu bilo super; ali uvijek su scene ljubljenja sa ženama izazivale svakakve uzvike negodovanja. I tako se to prenijelo na strip i ostalo do dana današnjeg.
No veli Burattini da u Zagoru ipak u zadnje vrijeme ima više žena, poput Marie Laveau ili Gambit (u kojim Zagor čak i vodi ljubav s njima – nije to prikazano, no čitatelj može maštati). Tako prilikom Zagorovog susreta s Amazonkama tijekom južnoameričke sage, Zagor susreće svoju staru poznanicu, Marie Laveau; i Burattini spominje završnu kontraverznu scenu, kao da Marie ima potencijalno dijete iz spolnog općenja sa Zagorom. No to naravno nije potvrđeno, ali autori su dali malo misliti čitateljima. |
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies; the man who never reads lives only one." |
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Zagor12
Advanced Member
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Croatia
6763 Posts
Member since 23/08/2010 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 11:34:08
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Znači, iz ovog Deejevog izvještaja smo naučili da:
1. Opet ćemo svjedočiti standardnom povratku u Darkwood - vrate se doma, kuća srušena. Kako originalno! Nešto što dosad nikada nismo vidjeli... 2. Ako itko želi radikalne promjene u serijalu, piši kući propalo. 3. Zagor će uvijek biti više gay nego hetero. 4. A ako ipak ima sinčića, idući Zagor će biti crnac! I to je valjda jedina ok ideja koju sam čuo u zadnjih nekoliko godina a da ima veze sa Zagorom. |
Z12 je sada Golub, ali sajt je ostao isti: http://superheroji.com.hr/ - Najnovije iz svijeta superheroja
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King Warrior
stripovi.com suradnik
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22339 Posts
Member since 10/11/2007 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 12:10:36
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Nema Bure muda da pokrene nesto novo i originalno, on ce uvijek biti u sjenci Nolitte, u stvari, tezi ka tome da bude kao Nolitta. Nazalost, on ce uvijek biti Nolittina losa kopija, isto kao sto ce Verni biti losa Ferrijeva kopija, valjda se zbog toga njih dvojica dobro i slazu.
Ne bih isao tako daleko i govorio da je Zagor vise gej nego hetero, Buretov Zagor je vise aseksualno bice. Boselli je dao Zagoru muda, Bure ga je ustrojio. Ova poredjenja sa John W. i komentari Vernija i Bureta o Zagorovoj seksualnosti, kako im je smijesno ako se ljubaka, su toliko idiotski da je to za ne povjerovati. Junaci su ljubakali i 60tih godina, a kamoli danas.
A sto se tice Marie i polemike da li je ostala trudna za vrijeme JA odiseje, pa ukoliko je za vrijeme Atlantide i Mua tehnologija toliko razvijena bila da zene ostaju trudne nakon jednog poljubca, onda je to moguce.
Vernija ste trebali pitati zasto PRECRTAVA Ferrijeve vinjete. Ukoliko pokusa da se izvadi sa omazom i slicnim stvarima, prekinuti ga i opet ponoviti da precrtava i da to nema veze sa omazom.
Bureta treba pitati zasto nema hrabrosti da napravi promjene i da bude malo vise originalan. Ako podje da trabunja o talibanima i tradiciji, onda ga treba podsjetiti da su upravo promjene podigle Zagoru prodaju prije dvadesetak godina.
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DeeCay
stripovi.com suradnik
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Croatia
21661 Posts
Member since 24/09/2002 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 12:33:03
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Mislim da ti to nema smisla pričati jer s jedne strane pričaju kako zagor ide ukorak s vremenom, uvode se stvarne lokacije i stvarni likovi za razliku od Nolittinih početaka, stvari se kao mijenjaju - a s druge strane se pozivaju na Nolittu i postavkama zagora iz šezdesetih. Burattini čak priča da se neke stvari ne usudi napisati kad daje scenarij Verniju na crtanje jer zna će prigovarati zašto je sad zagor napravio ovo ili ono, pa čak ide do te razine da pita vernija slaže li se s kojim rješenjem. Stvar je da talijanski fanovi vole ovaj status quo i takva je daljnja politika staffa, barem dok je Bure na čelu. mene oni podsjećaju na naše/vaše rasprave na sajtu, isto su tako oni gorljivi kad je u pitanju njihov junak na kojemu su odrasli. |
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies; the man who never reads lives only one." |
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kasper
Advanced Member
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10907 Posts
Member since 04/11/2001 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 12:33:26
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kad smo kod Bureta, kakva mu je ova zadnja epizoda sto je radio sa Priskom. volim Bureta, al samo kod epizoda koje su njegove, gde ne iskoristva stare poznate likove. jebem li ga, covek je u stanju napisati dobru epizodu, valjda ga masovnost ubi.
e, i da, Bure i Verni zajedno tvore smece |
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Zagor12
Advanced Member
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Croatia
6763 Posts
Member since 23/08/2010 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 12:43:59
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Ako imaju takve stavove, prodaja će rapidno padati u idućih desetak godina. Kada ostanu bez publike (tj. kada čitatelji postanu penzioneri, što će relativno brzo uslijediti pošto mladih fanova ima malo) ugasit će se samo tako.
Btw. apsolutno se slažem sa Kingom. Od riječi do riječi. |
Z12 je sada Golub, ali sajt je ostao isti: http://superheroji.com.hr/ - Najnovije iz svijeta superheroja
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DODSFERD
Advanced Member
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Pitcairn Island
29953 Posts
Member since 14/03/2014 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 13:24:10
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quote: Originally posted by Zagor12
Znači, iz ovog Deejevog izvještaja smo naučili da:
1. Opet ćemo svjedočiti standardnom povratku u Darkwood - vrate se doma, kuća srušena. Kako originalno! Nešto što dosad nikada nismo vidjeli...
Ako bi se pitalo takve koji bi stalno htjeli nešto drugačije tada bi trebalo baciti Zagora u neku daleku budućnost i od njega napraviti Nathana... siguran put u propast.
2. Ako itko želi radikalne promjene u serijalu, piši kući propalo.
Ja to ne želim niti me zanima i vjerujem da nisam jedini.
3. Zagor će uvijek biti više gay nego hetero.
To me puno ne tangira, može prakticirati i sodomiju samo da se ne tuče s androidima opremljenima najsuvremenijim oružjem.
4. A ako ipak ima sinčića, idući Zagor će biti crnac! I to je valjda jedina ok ideja koju sam čuo u zadnjih nekoliko godina a da ima veze sa Zagorom.
Ako je to mnogima OK onda se stvarno treba zabrinuti za budućnost Zagora.
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Sinaitakala Tu'imatamoana 'i Fanakavakilangi Fakafanua |
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Zagor12
Advanced Member
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Croatia
6763 Posts
Member since 23/08/2010 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 13:44:56
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Ovu raspravu koju ti, DODSFERD, pokrećeš sam vodio već milijun puta na forumu, i zaista je nemam snage ponovno voditi. Sve što želim u ovom Zagoru je stalni kontinuitet i moderna, originalna scenaristička rješenja a ne opetovana kopiranja jednog te istog koja su već postala perverzna koliko se recikliraju.
Ako si već mogu pustiti maštu na volju, osobno bih želio vidjeti Zagora u današnjem dobu, ali ne da iz prošlosti dođe u budućnost nego cijelu postavku njegovog svijeta u sadašnjosti. I svakako kad bi se to dogodilo ne bih želio da se redovna, originalna serija ugasi. Bile bi korisne te neke usporedne What If... edicije u drugom univerzumu. Čak sam jučer počeo pisati nešto na tu temu (zanimljivo kako se ova rasprava poklopila). Stavit ću u autorski izlog. |
Z12 je sada Golub, ali sajt je ostao isti: http://superheroji.com.hr/ - Najnovije iz svijeta superheroja
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DODSFERD
Advanced Member
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Pitcairn Island
29953 Posts
Member since 14/03/2014 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 14:20:34
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Ako Zagoru prijeti recikliranje što li onda reći za Texa koji je još žanrovski ograničeniji. Neka ponavljanja se stvarno ne mogu izbjeći ali ako to dođe do te mjere da nema ideja za smisliti nešto bar malo drugačije bolje je ugasiti serijal nego raditi eksperimente sa drugim univerzumima, barem ne u ovim edicijama koje trenutno izlaze. Na kraju krajeva, nigdje ne piše da Zagor mora imati 10000 epizoda.  |
Sinaitakala Tu'imatamoana 'i Fanakavakilangi Fakafanua |
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Zagor12
Advanced Member
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Croatia
6763 Posts
Member since 23/08/2010 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 14:32:53
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quote: Originally posted by DODSFERD
Ako Zagoru prijeti recikliranje što li onda reći za Texa koji je još žanrovski ograničeniji.
Potpuno si u pravu, Tex je jako ograničen strip kojega Bonelli uporno forsira i u njega gura najbolje što imaju od scenarista i crtača. Da nema toga, davno bi se on ugasio.
Problem je u tome što Zagor NIJE žanrovski ograničen strip i kod njega se može miješati sve sa svačim, a opet se motivi stalno kopiraju.
Btw. evo prve dvije stranice tog "mog" Zagora. Stavit ću ih još. Ako se ikome da čitati, i ako itko pročita, komentari su dobrodošli.
http://forum.stripovi.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=45424
NOTE: Ova verzija Zagora nema ništa protiv izvornog materijala i nikako ne smatram da bi ovako nešto trebalo zamijeniti ovo što imamo danas. Ovo je običan fan fiction. |
Z12 je sada Golub, ali sajt je ostao isti: http://superheroji.com.hr/ - Najnovije iz svijeta superheroja
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velka031
Advanced Member
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Croatia
17048 Posts
Member since 18/03/2010 |
Posted - 17/05/2014 : 22:50:44
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Da se serijal nakon skoro 600 epizoda scenaristicki ne ponavlja, bilo bi previse za ocekivati... Neka nama Zagora takvog kakav jest. |
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