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DeeCay
stripovi.com suradnik



Croatia
21597 Posts

Member since 24/09/2002

Posted - 05/01/2013 :  23:57:48  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send DeeCay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Malo copy&paste s drugog topica, kao reakcija na Fibrin Millerov run Daredevila...

Nakon prve knjige malo poveći zaokret, nisam u bi ni znao da je prva knjiga izdvojena miniserija. na početku druge knjige šok - jeftine superherojske pričice s jednim superherojskim nemezisom po epizodi, makljaža plus malo malo osobnog života (čitaj patetike) utkanog u scenarij. Ispočetka razočaran sve dok ne dolazi Miller za scenarističko kormilo. To im je zaista bila renesansa, nije ni čudno što se Daredevil tako digao. Više humora, prave introspekcije, bolje priče, negativci dobivaju nove dimenzije, prave Devilove dileme; dinamičnije kadriranje; stvarno je užitak čitati. Ove epizode što je olovkario Miller a radio Mackenzie, možda nisu ni trebale biti uključene u trade. No, onda nikad ne bi vidjeli kakva je razlika između dobrog i lošeg Daredevila.

Mogu samo ustvrditi; prije Millera Daredevil je bio sam još jedan prosječni strip o superherojima...

Dobar Mirekov tekst sa sajta, check it out!
http://www.stripovi.com/magazin/ne-boj-se-nebojse/228/

“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies; the man who never reads lives only one."
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Johnny Difool
Advanced Member



Croatia
13988 Posts

Member since 21/02/2010

Posted - 06/01/2013 :  00:22:04  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send Johnny Difool a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Mogu samo ustvrditi; prije Millera Daredevil je bio sam još jedan prosječni strip o superherojima...




E baš to, s iznimkom Yellowa Loeba i Salea (najtoplije preporučam ako nisi čitao!), ja sam dosad uvijek nalijetao na u najboljem slučaju osrednje epizode, i zbog toga mi je Odvažni Đavo bio dosta blijed i nezanimljiv.

Ali Miller i ova dvojica sve mijenjaju...

Ja necu imati s kim ostati mlad ako svi ostarite,
i ta ce mi mladost teško pasti...
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mr murdoc
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Switzerland
14555 Posts

Member since 02/01/2006

Posted - 06/01/2013 :  00:46:40  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send mr murdoc a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DeeCay

quote:
Originally posted by mr murdoc
Kupujem.


Ne mogu vjerovati da nisi znao da je ovo izašlo...

Vecinu stripova kupujem na engleskom ili njemackom,ali bi ovaj pozelio posjedovati i na hrvatskom:)

“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.”? Oscar Wilde
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DeeCay
stripovi.com suradnik



Croatia
21597 Posts

Member since 24/09/2002

Posted - 06/01/2013 :  00:50:29  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send DeeCay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Uzmi, cijeli Millerov run u paketu, nećeš zažaliti!

“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies; the man who never reads lives only one."
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mr murdoc
Advanced Member



Switzerland
14555 Posts

Member since 02/01/2006

Posted - 06/01/2013 :  17:52:16  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send mr murdoc a Private Message  Reply with Quote
1990-te su po meni bile "mrsave " godine za Daredevila.
Kreativni tim D. G. Chichester i Lee Weeks su samo nastavili sa produbljavanjem odnosa izmedu Murdocka i Foggy Nelson i njihovog ljubavnog trokuta sa Karen Page i to gurali sve do poprilicnog zasicenja..




Chichester i Scott McDaniels potom uskrsavaju Elektru, a DD u Fall From Grace dobiva novi kostim koji mi nikako nije "sjeo" i na svu srecu nije dugo potrajao.

1993 Frank Miller ponovo spasava ovaj karakter sa five-issue Daredevil: The Man Without Fear miniseries.U suradnji sa John Romita Jr.,Miler expandira svoj retcon o zivotu i smrti Murdockovog oca Jacka pod nazivom Battling Jack" Murdock.


1998 doslo je do rebootiranja brojeva DD pod nazivom canceled , da bi se ponovo nastavilo pod radnim naslovom Marvel Knights i dolaskom Joe Quesade na scenu koji u suradnji sa filmasem Kevin Smithom zapocinje Guardian Devil"..Prica u kojoj DD pokusava zastititi bebu za koju se smatra da je Messiah ili Anti-Christ., i u kojoj dolazi do tragicne smrti Karen Page


Smith je po meni u DD price donio jedan religijski i biblijski aspekt , ali je i poprilicno osvjezio ovog heroja ucinivsi ga klasicnim tragicarom.
"Parts of a Hole" je takoder suradnja Smitha i David Macka koja na svijetlo iznosi jedan meni vrlo drag karakter Maya Lopez, also known as Echo



takoder bi napomenuo story "Wake Up" koja prati reportera Ben Uricha dok istrazuje pozadinu borbe izmedu DD i Leap-Frog-a..


I naravno "Playing to the Camera" koje ujedno i zatvaraju proslo stoljece ...


“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.”? Oscar Wilde

Edited by - mr murdoc on 06/01/2013 18:05:57
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mr murdoc
Advanced Member



Switzerland
14555 Posts

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Posted - 07/01/2013 :  19:06:36  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send mr murdoc a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Daredevil Crossover..

Naravno , veliki sam fan Batmena i to je definitivno moj omiljeni lik iz DC univerzuma..
Oduvijek sam zelio vidjeti jedno odmjeravanje snaga izmedu Batman/Daredevil, jer bas DD smatram jedinim dostojnim protivnikom pri sukobu ova dva univezuma..
Do bola istrenirani borci cije su psihe pune demona koje trebaju drzati u sahu..pune emocija koje su duboko potisnute.
Ova dva tako slicna katraktera dijele i opsjednutost pravdom te kodexe o funkcionalnosti iste...sto ih ponekad i sve cesce dovodi do konfrotacije sa samim sobom i konstantno ih vraca na zatvoreni krug savjesti.
Zbog toga ih volim..

Postoji naravno i taj Crossover, koji nije los , ali ja zudim za boljim..



i legendarna scena..


“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.”? Oscar Wilde

Edited by - mr murdoc on 07/01/2013 19:07:17
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mr murdoc
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Switzerland
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Posted - 08/01/2013 :  16:59:30  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send mr murdoc a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Daredevil Team-Up..
Postoji ih nekolicina , ali kao karakter DD je samotnjak i tesko se uklapa u plesni duet, a kamoli u tim..ipak Spidey mu nekako najbolje lezi i tu se rodila nekakva kemija koja funcionira i nekakva metafizika koja se medusobno nadopunjava..
Zaigranost i suhi profesionalizam se nadopunjavaju u jednom naizmjenicnom vrltlogu osjecaja koji varira od smijesnog do tuznog ..i natrag.



Ima toga jos , pa me vi nadopunite ako vas je volja..



www.comicsalliance.com/media/2009/09/bromancepunisherdd.jpg" border="0">


“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.”? Oscar Wilde
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mr murdoc
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Switzerland
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Member since 02/01/2006

Posted - 18/01/2013 :  19:20:29  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send mr murdoc a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Trenutno citam team-up od Mark Waid & Chris Samnee ...svida mi se..


“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.”? Oscar Wilde

Edited by - mr murdoc on 18/01/2013 19:21:07
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Rick
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Serbia
899 Posts

Member since 21/01/2009

Posted - 20/01/2013 :  13:12:48  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send Rick a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ja sam krenuo sa Vejdovim, pa stao.

Ono što je Miler uradio sa DD, u trenutku kada je izdavača bio druga liga po prodaji, je neverovatno. I dalje za mene jedna od najboljih superherojština, toliko dobra da prevazilazi odrednicu superherojština, a to mi je oduvek i bilo osnovno merilo kvaliteta superherojskog stripa: koliko je scenarista uspeo da radnju predstavi tako da ljudske emocije nadvladaju superherojske moći. U suprotnom slučaju, likovi ostaju neuhvatljivi za nas čitaoce-obične smrtnike.

Kada sam, odmah nakon osnovne škole, prvi put zakoračio u Mardokov svet, posle nekoliko pročitanih EKS-ova, rekao sam sebi- znači može i ovako.

"Duh Sa Sekirom nikada nije zaista napustio Darkwood. I dalje pazi na svoje kraljevstvo i nasledje. I ponekad se javi, kao pozdrav, ili opomena, kako kome."
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brni
Advanced Member



Croatia
10043 Posts

Member since 18/06/2009

Posted - 20/01/2013 :  13:20:47  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send brni a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by mr murdoc

Trenutno citam team-up od Mark Waid & Chris Samnee ...svida mi se..






Meni je Waid fantazija..nisam jos dosa do ovoga di si ti ali zasad mi je odlican..ovo je najnoviji broj jeli tako..Daredevil 22..

"Clark Kent je Supermanova kritika covjecanstva"
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mr murdoc
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Switzerland
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Posted - 20/01/2013 :  15:45:57  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send mr murdoc a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Rick

Ja sam krenuo sa Vejdovim, pa stao.

Ono što je Miler uradio sa DD, u trenutku kada je izdavača bio druga liga po prodaji, je neverovatno. I dalje za mene jedna od najboljih superherojština, toliko dobra da prevazilazi odrednicu superherojština, a to mi je oduvek i bilo osnovno merilo kvaliteta superherojskog stripa: koliko je scenarista uspeo da radnju predstavi tako da ljudske emocije nadvladaju superherojske moći. U suprotnom slučaju, likovi ostaju neuhvatljivi za nas čitaoce-obične smrtnike.

Kada sam, odmah nakon osnovne škole, prvi put zakoračio u Mardokov svet, posle nekoliko pročitanih EKS-ova, rekao sam sebi- znači može i ovako.

Da , tocno si opisao i moj osjecaj kada sam prvi put otvorio EKS i poceo sa citanjem Milerovog Daredevila.

“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.”? Oscar Wilde
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mr murdoc
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Switzerland
14555 Posts

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Posted - 20/01/2013 :  15:47:06  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send mr murdoc a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by brni

quote:
Originally posted by mr murdoc

Trenutno citam team-up od Mark Waid & Chris Samnee ...svida mi se..






Meni je Waid fantazija..nisam jos dosa do ovoga di si ti ali zasad mi je odlican..ovo je najnoviji broj jeli tako..Daredevil 22..

Da, to je zadnji broj koji sam kupio..Waidu dajem sansu

“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.”? Oscar Wilde
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Smomo8
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Croatia
666 Posts

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Posted - 20/01/2013 :  17:37:03  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send Smomo8 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ne vidim ništa u Waidovom run-u. Ne volim kada je sve tako vedro i veselo,pogotovo kod lika kao što je Daredevil

"There are no men like me. Only me"

Tražim/nudim stripove za razmjenu : http://forum.stripovi.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=47082
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mr murdoc
Advanced Member



Switzerland
14555 Posts

Member since 02/01/2006

Posted - 20/01/2013 :  17:42:27  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send mr murdoc a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Smomo8

Ne vidim ništa u Waidovom run-u. Ne volim kada je sve tako vedro i veselo,pogotovo kod lika kao što je Daredevil

i tebe je kao i mene Miler izgleda zauvijek obiljezio

“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.”? Oscar Wilde
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Mr. Bushido
stripovi.com suradnik



Croatia
11108 Posts

Member since 23/09/2005

Posted - 20/01/2013 :  17:49:21  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send Mr. Bushido a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Smomo8

Ne vidim ništa u Waidovom run-u. Ne volim kada je sve tako vedro i veselo,pogotovo kod lika kao što je Daredevil


Po čemu si zaključio da je sve vedro i veselo? Jer, baš i nije tako.

Uostalom, ne mora se svaka interpretacija Daredevila furati na Millerovu.

Comics is any art you can read. -- Sean T. Collins
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brni
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Croatia
10043 Posts

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Posted - 20/01/2013 :  17:50:14  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send brni a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Meni je Waid odlican i njegov Daredevil je upravo ono sta mora biti pod njegovim perom..a superheoroji evoluiraju..nije ovo Bonelli..i Batman je izasa iz sjene i nije u Morrisonovom runu onaj zakrabuljeni Batman u Year One razdoblju..

"Clark Kent je Supermanova kritika covjecanstva"

Edited by - brni on 20/01/2013 17:50:44
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Smomo8
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Croatia
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Posted - 20/01/2013 :  17:52:32  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send Smomo8 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Zaključio sam jer sam čitao nekoliko svezaka. Očito sam naviknut na Bendisa previše. Možda kada bih čitao u komadu bi mi se više svidjelo.

"There are no men like me. Only me"

Tražim/nudim stripove za razmjenu : http://forum.stripovi.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=47082
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mr murdoc
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Switzerland
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Posted - 20/01/2013 :  17:56:34  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send mr murdoc a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Evo jedan zanimljiv osvrt ako nekoga zanima .


quote:
WHY "MARK WAID'S DAREDEVIL"?

One of the criticisms of comic reviewers I see the most is that they're too story-oriented. Too many comic reviews talk only about the writing and then pay lip service to the art. The colorist and letterer are ignored. Judgments are then drawn about the reviewers, usually to the effect that they have no artistic vocabulary, that they're blind, that they're wannabe comic book writers, or that they're so blinded by writing as writers, themselves, that they don't see the forest for the trees.

When I started writing my review of "Mark Waid's 'Daredevil' run" this week, I thought of those criticisms. Was I just as guilty of it because I'm referring to the book as being the writer's? Was I ignoring what Paolo Rivera and Marcos Martin were contributing to the book because I'm blinded?

No, not at all. The big problem here is that the art team rotates so often and that the series has so many volumes and so many memorable runs on it already, that the only way to uniquely refer to this series is by the one core creator on it. Mark Waid is writing all the issues. Rivera, Martin, Chris Samnee, Mike Allred, Kano, Khoi Pham, and Marco Checchetto are all the artists contributing to the first 13 issues. Would you want to read a review of "The Waid/Rivera/Martin/Samnee/Allred/Pham/Checchetto 'Daredevil' Run"? I'd have to create a keyboard shortcut to spit that out every time I wanted to type it.

I've only read the first hardcover collection, so it's just the "Waid/Rivera/Martin 'Daredevil' run" to me right now. Maybe that's more digestible, but it still gets unwieldy.

What I'm getting at here is that sometimes the reason a reviewer might seem to ignore the art on a larger run of comics in these modern times is because artists rotate on books faster than the tub on a front-loading washer. Pity.

Putting aside the meta part of the discussion, I loved the hardcover collection of the first six issues. I also just noticed the official title is "Daredevil by Mark Waid" and I laughed out loud. OK, so we can really blame Marvel now...

The odd thing that impressed me most about the book was the font selection on the dustjacket. It's not the usual Marvel typeface choice. It's a thin san serif font. I believe it's Century Gothic, judging by the distinct question mark glyph. If that's the case, let's all start the rumor that Ike Perlmutter demanded the font's usage because it uses up to 30% less ink!

In any case, I like the open feel to the block of text on the back cover from that selection, though for some reason it bothers me a bit on the inside flaps. It looks too large there, I think, and a little tattered with the italicized titles strewn throughout.

As to the content of the book: Everyone who's praised this title before me is right. It lives up to the expectations set by popular and critical acclaim. Waid does what he has to do to transition the series back from the grim and gritty towards a slightly lighter character piece that plays well in the Marvel Universe. He brings a touch of Silver Age to a very modern book, emphasizing Daredevil's two strongest characteristics along the way: Matt Murdock's blindness and law degree. Focusing on those two facets leads to some interesting and dramatic stories without needing to drag Murdock down into hell. Waid puts Murdock/Daredevil back into some interesting corners and always finds a clever way out. Yes, there is plenty of fighting, but it's all done in service to a larger idea. It's brilliant, classical superhero storytelling.

The art reflects that shift, too. It's nice to see pages full of color instead of black ink now.

Rivera and Martin's work blends seamlessly together. Their takes on visualizing Daredevil's superpowers work very nicely, from the inverted lines to the squared off items whose smells or sounds tickle his senses. Both artists have the ability to take a commonplace scene and transform it into something unique to the world of comics with their page layouts. Rivera led the way with a walk into the subway or across a busy city street, but Martin kept up the pace with closeup panels that create a staccato rhythm to an otherwise simple scene.

Joe Caramagna's lettering shines in the book, too, with some wide open sound effects that help to sell the senses that Daredevil is feeling at any time.

The colors from Javier Rodriguez and Muntsa Vicente complement the art. They don't fight for attention. They let the open linework shine, using minimal special effects and good solid color theory to keep the pages inviting to the eye without being boring. There's no need to "sculpt" this kind of art, and they both know it.

This is a series that isn't trying to look like a movie. It's trying to look like a very strong comic book, and that works. The coloring is a large part of that story.

So, yes, "Daredevil By Mark Waid" Volume 1 is highly recommended from me, too. The hardcover carries a price tag of $19.99, which is on the low end of Marvel's spectrum these days. Given Marvel's publishing patterns lately, you can choose to go with these slim hardcovers or wait a couple of years for an Omnibus edition. I choose not to wait. This stuff is too good.



“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.”? Oscar Wilde
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Mr. Bushido
stripovi.com suradnik



Croatia
11108 Posts

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Posted - 20/01/2013 :  17:58:54  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send Mr. Bushido a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Smomo8

Zaključio sam jer sam čitao nekoliko svezaka. Očito sam naviknut na Bendisa previše. Možda kada bih čitao u komadu bi mi se više svidjelo.


Ne znam što si čitao, ali nemoj da te zavara ton stripa. Ovdje nije baš sve med i mlijeko.

Ton nije poput Bendisovog, Millerovog ili Brubakerovog, ali niti ne mora biti. Ozbiljnim temama se može baviti i na Waidov način.

Comics is any art you can read. -- Sean T. Collins
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Paka01
stripovi.com suradnik



Croatia
5522 Posts

Member since 14/02/2009

Posted - 20/01/2013 :  17:59:22  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send Paka01 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by brni

Meni je Waid odlican i njegov Daredevil je upravo ono sta mora biti pod njegovim perom..a superheoroji evoluiraju..nije ovo Bonelli..i Batman je izasa iz sjene i nije u Morrisonovom runu onaj zakrabuljeni Batman u Year One razdoblju..



Šta bi samo značilo da nisi pročita dovoljno Bonellija, čim pišeš ovakve gluposti.
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brni
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Croatia
10043 Posts

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Posted - 20/01/2013 :  18:01:18  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send brni a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Paka01

quote:
Originally posted by brni

Meni je Waid odlican i njegov Daredevil je upravo ono sta mora biti pod njegovim perom..a superheoroji evoluiraju..nije ovo Bonelli..i Batman je izasa iz sjene i nije u Morrisonovom runu onaj zakrabuljeni Batman u Year One razdoblju..



Šta bi samo značilo da nisi pročita dovoljno Bonellija, čim pišeš ovakve gluposti.



Ok falia sam..triba sam napisati nije ovo Zagor..

"Clark Kent je Supermanova kritika covjecanstva"
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Paka01
stripovi.com suradnik



Croatia
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Posted - 20/01/2013 :  18:03:25  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send Paka01 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Generaliziraš, isto ko i hc bonellijevci koji tupe da je Superman samo hrpa mišića koja sve rješava bez problema.
Bosellijev Zagor, pogotovo neke ranije epizode kad ga je tek krenija pisat su odlično i kvalitetno štivo, al da ne skrećemo previše u offtopic, mr murdoc će popizdit
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Smomo8
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Croatia
666 Posts

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Posted - 20/01/2013 :  18:05:46  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send Smomo8 a Private Message  Reply with Quote

[quote]
Ne znam što si čitao, ali nemoj da te zavara ton stripa. Ovdje nije baš sve med i mlijeko.

Ton nije poput Bendisovog, Millerovog ili Brubakerovog, ali niti ne mora biti. Ozbiljnim temama se može baviti i na Waidov način.
[quote]

Mozda si u pravu,čitao sam samo jedan broj kad ide u neko podzemlje,ali kako je to bilo dosta davno,ne sjećam se detalja. Znam samo da mi nije ostalo u dobrom sjećanju

"There are no men like me. Only me"

Tražim/nudim stripove za razmjenu : http://forum.stripovi.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=47082
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brni
Advanced Member



Croatia
10043 Posts

Member since 18/06/2009

Posted - 20/01/2013 :  18:06:10  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send brni a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Paka01

Generaliziraš, isto ko i hc bonellijevci koji tupe da je Superman samo hrpa mišića koja sve rješava bez problema.
Bosellijev Zagor, pogotovo neke ranije epizode kad ga je tek krenija pisat su odlično i kvalitetno štivo, al da ne skrećemo previše u offtopic, mr murdoc će popizdit



Ok..bizmo ca dok nije pocea pucat..

"Clark Kent je Supermanova kritika covjecanstva"
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TomViolence
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Croatia
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Member since 30/12/2012

Posted - 20/01/2013 :  19:11:57  Show Profile Show Extended Profile  Send TomViolence a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Neki dan primjetio da u knjižnici imaju sva Fibrina izdanja Millerovog runa, pa odlučio sve to pročitati.
Upravo pročitao The Man Without Fear miniserijal, i razočaran sam.
Nekako mi je čitava stvar previše neinspirirana i generična, čini se kao da je posao odrađen samo radi plaće.
Par okej akcijskih sekvenci, par scena koje očito postoje samo da se popuni kvota stranica, par scena koje je Miller reciklirao iz vlastitih starijih stripova(The Dark Knight Returns i Batman: Year One, specifično), na momente iznadprosječan crtež(makar nisam prevelik ljubitelj JRJR-a), na momente veoma upečatljiva paleta boja, uglavnom poprilično nezanimljiva origin priča.
The Dark Knight Returns je po meni apsolutni vrhunac mainstream američkog superherojskog stripa, ali ovo je čisti prosjek, 5/10. Skinuto sa "to buy" liste.
Sutra se posuđuje druga Fibrina kolekcija Daredevila, i očekujem da će biti puno bolja od ovoga.
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