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mcn
Advanced Member
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Croatia
6666 Posts
Member since 28/12/2002 |
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hello
Senior Member
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Croatia
2731 Posts
Member since 14/07/2006 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 09:28:19
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quote: Originally posted by mcn
Slazzem se s Markosom. U par navrata sam eksperimentirao s jeftinim izdanjima i nijednom to nije povechalo prodaju, samo je smanjilo prihod. Bojim se da je situacija kakva jest: koga zanima, taj kupuje, a ti raccunaj na pokrivanje u godinu i pol, dvije, dok ne stekness bazu vjernih i revnih kupaca.
Na drugo pitanje ne bih sad odgovarao.
mcn
Ovdje bi se radilo samo o smanjenju cijene prvih brojeva, drugi bi bili s neznatno nižom PC, nešto slicno kao što rade Jutarnji i Vecernji list. Ponude prvu knjigu puno niže da privuku ljude, a onda ide normalna cijena. Na interliberu sam vidio jedan atlas kojeg su snizili na 150 kn i iako mi nije bila namjera kupiti atlas nisam mu odolio i kupio sam ga, a u 5 minuta sam vidio još troje ljudi koji su ga isto kupili. Slobo i Tino su mi takoder rekli da su ljudi dosta zainteresirani za Spawna, ali im je cijena visoka. Zbog tih razloga sam došao na ovu ideju. |
www.izdavanje-knjiga-dani.hr www.vangogh.hr |
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mcn
Advanced Member
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Croatia
6666 Posts
Member since 28/12/2002 |
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hello
Senior Member
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Croatia
2731 Posts
Member since 14/07/2006 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 09:40:59
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Kljucno pitanje je: Da li bih s ovom akcijom dobio barem 50 novih kupaca na 200-230 onih koji su/ce ionako kupiti Spawna i Strance u raju? Dakle promotivna cijena za prve brojeve, reklamni letci i nova prodajna mjesta uz nadam se i širenje usmene predaje  Pa ako je mogla Životinjska abeceda u 2000 komada, zar ovi stripovi ne mogu u barem 250. |
www.izdavanje-knjiga-dani.hr www.vangogh.hr |
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teller
Advanced Member
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Slovenia
19108 Posts
Member since 02/06/2008 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 09:51:51
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Mislim, da bi to išlo, poznato je kako popusti djeluju na ljude,kupe i stvari koji inace nebi ni u snu-evo i ja obecavam, da cu kupit Spawna-ako obecaš u ime Van Gogha,da cete izgurati MR svih preko 25o brojeva. |
CITAJTE TELLERA,... DA BI POSTALI BOLJI LJUDI! STRIP JUNAK KOJI UCI POŠTENJU I PRAVDI!
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zkne
Junior Member
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491 Posts
Member since 18/05/2005 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 10:09:03
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Da bi isprobao svoju teoriju stavi na aukcije tako snizene cijene svojih izdanja (ne kao komplet koji si vec stavio vec svako izdanje posebno)i vidjet ces isplati li ti se to
p.s. Kad ce u Zadar fell i kade? |
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mcn
Advanced Member
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Croatia
6666 Posts
Member since 28/12/2002 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 10:14:10
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>Pa ako je mogla Životinjska abeceda u 2000 komada, zar ovi stripovi >ne mogu u barem 250.
To su jabuke i francuski kljuccevi. ŽA cilja puno vece tržište (djecu) koje je, stjecajem okolnosti, puno manje zasiceno (pedesetak slikovnica u zadnje dvije godine?) i gdje su roditelji navikli dati koliko se trazzi. Dani ciljaju fanove americkog stripa koji ne citaju engleski i nemaju kreditnu karticu, dakle teence kojima cijena jest malo visoka.
mcn |
Zar danas još niste bili na www.darkomacan.com ? *** Moje aukcije: http://www.stripovi.com/index.asp?page=auction-search&Action=1&Seller=mcn |
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hello
Senior Member
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Croatia
2731 Posts
Member since 14/07/2006 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 10:27:53
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quote: Originally posted by zkne
Da bi isprobao svoju teoriju stavi na aukcije tako snizene cijene svojih izdanja (ne kao komplet koji si vec stavio vec svako izdanje posebno)i vidjet ces isplati li ti se to
p.s. Kad ce u Zadar fell i kade?
Pa eto to cu i napraviti. Stavit cu po dvije aukcije s rokom od 5 dana i obje ce imati opciju kupi odmah. Dakle ako budu dva kupca za Spawna i dva kupca za Strance. |
www.izdavanje-knjiga-dani.hr www.vangogh.hr |
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hello
Senior Member
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Croatia
2731 Posts
Member since 14/07/2006 |
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DeeCay
stripovi.com suradnik
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Croatia
21661 Posts
Member since 24/09/2002 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 11:07:09
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hello, jel ti dobro? Nekako si se smanjio i kosa ti je nešto rijeda i bjelja?! |
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies; the man who never reads lives only one." |
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lwood
Advanced Member
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Colombia
47453 Posts
Member since 09/12/2005 |
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Markos
Webmaster
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Croatia
29478 Posts
Member since 27/08/2001 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 11:37:55
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uf. Ajmo ovako: ... U biti, prvo mali disklejmer. Moje znanje i stavovi o izdavaštvu su nastali iskljucivo kao rezultat svega onoga sto sam ja kao citatelj htio od izdavaca (sajt, najave, plan za par godina unaprijed, debeli preview, komunikacija s citateljima, kvaliteta, redovitost itd itd), te na osnovu iskustva u ovih 4 godine bavljenja izdavanjem. Kao takvi, nisu nužno tocni niti bi ih se trebalo uzimati bez rezerve.
Ono što je po meni kljucno je stvoriti kod ljudi povjerenje da ce izdanje koje im nudiš preživjeti do kraja serije. Siguran sam da dobar broj ljudi ceka da izadju brojevi 3-4-5 pa da tek onda kupe sve brojeve, jer im je dosta nezavršenih serijala, em sto u tom slucaju dobar dio potencijalnih kupaca vec ima dobar dio tih serijala na engleskom i nece kupovati ponovo ono što vec imaju ako nisu sigurni da ceš izdržati do kraja. Stoga MORAŠ biti spreman objaviti brzo prvih 5-6 brojeva iako ti to donosi gubitak. Ako ne mozes to izdrzati, onda si u problemima, jer ulazis u zacaran krug (ljudi ne kupuju jer ti ne izdajes nove brojeve, a novi brojevi ne izlaze jer ljudi ne kupuju stare). U principu, ono što tebi fali je neki jak serijal koji bi sigurno bio u plusu i koji bi ti koliko-toliko pokrivao minuse ostalih, neprofitnih serijala (kao što je to npr. Ken Parker Fibri). Bez takvog serijala, jednostavno moraš dodatno ulagati i objavljivati nove brojeve makar bio u minusu, nadajuci se da ce oni dodatno povuci stare brojeve (sto je uglavnom pravilo). Dakle, mozda ostavit sirenje ponude sa strane i forsirati vec zapocete serijale (tj. bilo bi ti pametnije da si objavio Spawn 2 nego Fell i Kade).
Dalje, smanjivanje cijene prvih brojeva SADA, pola godine - godinu dana nakon izlaska je riskantno iz sljedeceg razloga: kupci koji su platili 180 kuna odmah po izlasku se mogu naljutiti sto je cijena pala na 120 i onda kad izadje novi broj, nece ga kupiti odmah nego ce cekati da cijena opet padne na 120. (sto se mozda nikad nece desiti, a oni ce s vremenom mozda izgubiti interes pa ga nece kupiti uopce). A kako ti je prodaja u tih prvih 3 mjeseca jako bitna da pokrije sto veci dio troskova (pogotovo tisak), to ti može biti jako opasno, pogotovo zato što ne možeš biti siguran da ce to smanjenje cijene rezultirati znacajnijim povecanjem prodaje koje ce ti pokriti gubitak. Dovoljno je sto su popusti dvaput godisnje na festivalima, ljudi vec sada cekaju njih i ne kupuju odmah. Ako ih naviknes da ce ti izdanja (mozda) pojeftiniti relativno brzo...
Dalje, vidio sam onaj tvoj popis prodaje - onih 11 primjeraka što piše knjiznice - jesu li to gradske knjiznice ili knjižare? Ako su gradske knjiznice - onda je to premalo, realno bi trebao prodati bar 25-30 primjeraka knjiznicama, promijeni distributera ili uzmi jos jednog.
Ili, ukratko, rješenje tvojih problema je da kreneš s nekim bonelli junakom:) Moja preporuka (pri tom ne mislim na kvalitet stripa, nego na ono što tebi treba - a to je komercijalni potencijal): Nick Raider. Inace bi to bila Julia, ali ju je Van Gogh pokopao, pa onda ništa od toga. Mada, možda cak i ona dolazi u obzir, ako objaviš odmah novih 12 brojeva u komadu. |
Trouble will find me |
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Witchblade
Senior Member
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Croatia
2754 Posts
Member since 22/07/2002 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 11:42:14
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Odgovor na prvo: otprilike se slažem s mcnom, Markosom i drugima koji imaju slicno mišljenje. Odgovor na drugo: vec sam kupio Strance 1 i 2 i Fell, i ne bi me smetalo ni da su (ne previše) skuplji, iako znam engleski i redovno kupujem preko neta i Pajtaka, ali ovo ulazi i pod podršku izdavacu . Spawn mi je dosta nisko na listi (stavka "možda, jednog dana"), uzeo bih ga odmah jedino da je cijena nerealno niska. Kade mi po ovoj cijeni nije preskup, ali nije prioritet (takoder, uzeo bih ga više zbog podrške izdavacu nego izdanja samog). Više nije u pitanju samo cijena, nego i smještajni kapaciteti... police se lagano preljevaju, što istovremeno veseli i plaši  |
"All deaths horrible. Also inevitable. Nod. Get treat." |
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teller
Advanced Member
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Slovenia
19108 Posts
Member since 02/06/2008 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 12:04:53
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Markos je sve reko i ima potpuno pravo, osim jedne stvari: Bonelli za spas po mome nisu ni Julija ni NIck,Julija je vec neslavno propala (isto sudbinu bi doživila i sa drugim izdavacem),a Nickov almanah od Libellusa baš se i ne prodaje za med, tako da je to opet pitanje na pitanje.Krim-žanr valjda ne pali. Ne pali ni osobito western ali ipak bolje od krim-žanra.Nick je još uvijek lako nabavljiv kod Dnevnika pa i nema neku veliku masu zainteresiranih. Možete se smijat ali po mome skromnom sudu od preostalih junaka Bonellija koji još ne izlazi samo Kapetan MIKI u luksuznoj izvedbi (na nacin MR) može proc.Prošo bi i na nacin Bleka i Marka kod Ludensa ali sa novim pravilima Tiska i nezainteresirašcu Bernarda, to je jedina opcija.Ako se uzme, da je cijena prava za Mikija tu negde kao za Rendžera(nisu osobito skupa)odgovor se namece sam od sebe. Kada bi se citala kvaliteta Fibra bi žarila i palila, ali izgleda da je citateljstvo ove Ex Yuge pretežno bonellinostalgicarsko.Stripove uzima više kao opuštanje, nego da u njima traži neka saznanja ili životne naputke.I sam strip uzimam kao pola ure opuštanja, kao i sex (znatno manje od pola ure, ako sam iskren), knjige,tv i ostalo. Ne volim strip koji me zmori. |
CITAJTE TELLERA,... DA BI POSTALI BOLJI LJUDI! STRIP JUNAK KOJI UCI POŠTENJU I PRAVDI!
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HC
Average Member
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Croatia
943 Posts
Member since 28/11/2006 |
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teller
Advanced Member
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Slovenia
19108 Posts
Member since 02/06/2008 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 12:29:26
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Za Trapera Kerryja se slažem-kratko i kvalitetno. |
CITAJTE TELLERA,... DA BI POSTALI BOLJI LJUDI! STRIP JUNAK KOJI UCI POŠTENJU I PRAVDI!
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provodina
Average Member
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Croatia
897 Posts
Member since 07/05/2007 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 12:29:36
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Tocno ono o cemu je Markos govorio ... Bilo bi puno pametnije da si sada izbacio knjigu 2 Spawna jer tocno je ono što Markos govori kupac ceka da imaš neko pokrice. Evo ja osobno necu kupiti ni Fell ni Kade dok ne vidim Spawna knjigu 2 na prolice, a na CRŠ sljedeci novu knjigu pa neka bude i 8 epizoda nije problem jer onda ipak ispada da cu do kraja sljedece godine imati 26 epizoda. A za to primjer ti mogu dati svoga prijatelja koji je narucio MV od libellusa tek nakon godinu dana izdavanja kupivši sve što je do tada izašlo.Tako bi krenio i Spawn. |
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provodina
Average Member
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Croatia
897 Posts
Member since 07/05/2007 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 12:31:32
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quote: Originally posted by teller
Markos je sve reko i ima potpuno pravo, osim jedne stvari: Bonelli za spas po mome nisu ni Julija ni NIck,Julija je vec neslavno propala (isto sudbinu bi doživila i sa drugim izdavacem),a Nickov almanah od Libellusa baš se i ne prodaje za med, tako da je to opet pitanje na pitanje.Krim-žanr valjda ne pali. Ne pali ni osobito western ali ipak bolje od krim-žanra.Nick je još uvijek lako nabavljiv kod Dnevnika pa i nema neku veliku masu zainteresiranih. Možete se smijat ali po mome skromnom sudu od preostalih junaka Bonellija koji još ne izlazi samo Kapetan MIKI u luksuznoj izvedbi (na nacin MR) može proc.Prošo bi i na nacin Bleka i Marka kod Ludensa ali sa novim pravilima Tiska i nezainteresirašcu Bernarda, to je jedina opcija.Ako se uzme, da je cijena prava za Mikija tu negde kao za Rendžera(nisu osobito skupa)odgovor se namece sam od sebe. Kada bi se citala kvaliteta Fibra bi žarila i palila, ali izgleda da je citateljstvo ove Ex Yuge pretežno bonellinostalgicarsko.Stripove uzima više kao opuštanje, nego da u njima traži neka saznanja ili životne naputke.I sam strip uzimam kao pola ure opuštanja, kao i sex (znatno manje od pola ure, ako sam iskren), knjige,tv i ostalo. Ne volim strip koji me zmori.
Mislim da je Spawn baš takav tip stripa, ali rade ce se kupiti kolekcionarski Zagor koji izgleda bože sacuvaj nego dati priliku novom.U tome je problem. |
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DeeCay
stripovi.com suradnik
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Croatia
21661 Posts
Member since 24/09/2002 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 12:45:23
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Nisu li puno skuplja prava za Bonellija nego na ove naslove koje Dani izdaje?
Nece valjda sad s alternative preci na Bonelli. Pa zamisli da Lavirint prede na Bonelli?! |
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies; the man who never reads lives only one." |
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HC
Average Member
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Croatia
943 Posts
Member since 28/11/2006 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 13:08:35
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Pa Dani nema slogan "samo dobri stripovi", ništa ga ne sprjecava da obavi Bonellija. Recimo kerry ili PSDZ bi dobro legli, a prodaja bi sigurno bila uspješna |
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kico
Advanced Member
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Croatia
11381 Posts
Member since 22/12/2004 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 13:35:11
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quote: Originally posted by HC
Pa Dani nema slogan "samo dobri stripovi", ništa ga ne sprjecava da obavi Bonellija. Recimo kerry ili PSDZ bi dobro legli, a prodaja bi sigurno bila uspješna
Ma kakav Kerry ili PSDZ?! Izdaj "Nikolina"! On Dubrovcanin,ti Dubrovcanin! Prvih 800 komada uvijek možeš uvalit Turistickoj Zajednici Dubrovnika za promociju svog grada!
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mladjo
Advanced Member
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Croatia
20013 Posts
Member since 15/04/2007 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 14:40:48
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quote: Originally posted by hello
Evo stavio sam dva Spawna, oba za 120 kn, poštarina na moj trošak, stavljeno u vitrinu i bumo vidjeli da li to pali.
To ti možda nije dobra ideja. Jer mnogi su kupili to izdanje po punoj cijeni. A sada ti daješ, samo tako, iz vedra neba 30% jeftinije. Mislim, ljudi ce razmišljati:"Gle, izašao je novi Spawn. Koliko, 180 kn? Ma bum sacekao da ga Hello ponudi za manje na aukcijama za par mjeseci." I opet si u zacaranom krugu. Evo, u cemu je po meni greška(cisto onak amaterski:)) Ti cekaš da ti se jedno izdanje (konkretno Spawn) pokrije sa prodajom, pa onda kreceš izdavati drugi broj. Mislim da ti to dugorocno nije isplativo.Trebaš gurati redovitim tempom, makar bio u gubitku nakon prvog broja, jer tek tako možeš dugorocno ostvariti zaradu ili barem pokriti izdanje. Eto, ak je ovo vec netko napisao, izbrišite post, nemam sad vremena sve citati:)) |
COUNT ZERO INTERRUPT an interrupt of a process decrements a counter to zero
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Markos
Webmaster
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Croatia
29478 Posts
Member since 27/08/2001 |
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mladjo
Advanced Member
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Croatia
20013 Posts
Member since 15/04/2007 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 14:51:55
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Kad je Spawn izašao, u drugom mjesecu? Znai, u 9 mjeseci prodaje, ti si imao 4 popusta (prednarudžba, Mafest, CRŠ, i sad ovo nudenje na aukcijama). Znai, dobar dio vremena se to izdanje moglo kupiti u poprilicno nižoj cijeni, pa svejedno nije prouzrokovalo veliku prodaju. Ako si na CRŠ-u, uz onoliko posjetitelja i uz 30 kn popusta (što je bio jedan od vecih popusta)prodao samo 7 komada, onda mislim da ti (trajno)smanjenje cijene ne bi povecalo prodaju.
Znaš kaj bi bilo najbolje: Kao što je netko vec bio negdje predložio, štampaj u 100 primjeraka i stavi duplu cijenu, pa ce se valjda isplatiti:)) |
COUNT ZERO INTERRUPT an interrupt of a process decrements a counter to zero
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mladjo
Advanced Member
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Croatia
20013 Posts
Member since 15/04/2007 |
Posted - 24/11/2008 : 14:52:32
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quote: Originally posted by Markos
Pa, vise manje si ponovio ono sto sam mu ja rekao:)
Do vraga, procitan sam:)) |
COUNT ZERO INTERRUPT an interrupt of a process decrements a counter to zero
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